quote:I have to pick up Tiff's sister after work, but I'll be by afterwards.
Is she younger than Tiff?? If so, than you should bring her along and hook a brotha up.
-------------------- It doesn't get any more serious than a Rhinocerus about to charge your ass. Posts: 1053 | From: Apple Valley, MN | Registered: Sep 2001
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Brad, was there a game last night? Or is there none this week because of the Holiday?
I heard that Matt Bundy is no longer playing Monday nights because of all the amutures that are playing now. I guess he keeps seeing the bad beats you mentioned from your last Monday night.... Thoughts?
Posts: 5484 | From: St. Paul, Mn | Registered: Apr 2002
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I actually spoke with bundy about that a week or so ago. I think it's more of a my shit don't stink philosophy rather then amatures playing. He seems to belive that he is the best poker player around, and that anyone who beats him isn't as good and just stuck around with shit. Granted I have never been there for cards, but how can anyone trust a vegaterian.
Posts: 740 | From: Tranyland Pending | Registered: Oct 2000
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It's just fucking cards man. You're only as good as your hand. Skill is used to force people and to bluff thats it. Skill cant change your cards. If you can whistle yankee doodle dandy out of you ass that is a true gift, and does make you better then other people. Posts: 740 | From: Tranyland Pending | Registered: Oct 2000
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quote:Originally posted by Trany: It's just fucking cards man. You're only as good as your hand. Skill is used to force people and to bluff thats it. Skill cant change your cards. If you can whistle yankee doodle dandy out of you ass that is a true gift, and does make you better then other people.
I wont deny that there is luck involved in the game, and anyone who thinks they're a good player that doesnt think there is luck involved needs a reality check. That is probibly part of Matt's problem, that he thinks heshould never get unlucky.
But, there is also more skill involved than alot of people think who dont play very often. Sure, you cant change your cards in a single hand, but being able to win in the long run by minimizing your losses in spotting a loosing hand while maximizing the amount you win on winning hands is what its all about. Its all about numbers with respect to profit vs. loss throughout a session. And it takes skill to continually make the correct descisions to do this.
Patience is the name of the game. If you get impatient your going to loose no matter how good you think you are. And this is a skill MANY people lack and one that took a while for me to develope. This is also part of Matt's problem i think.
Anyways, i dont think im the best player around... say what you want. But i do think im good, and results say more than me telling you that.
Hopefully, after taking a week off of work to play in most of the Fall Poker Classic Tournements at Canterbury, ill be able to back that up even more by winning some money in a couple of them.
[ 09-07-2004, 13:50: Message edited by: Ender ]
-------------------- It doesn't get any more serious than a Rhinocerus about to charge your ass. Posts: 1053 | From: Apple Valley, MN | Registered: Sep 2001
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I agree with a lot of what you say Luke. Luck is involved coupled with skill and reading players patterns/styles etc. I do think that you and Matt have the same feeling about the Monday night game/low limit tables. You both get angry when newbies stay in with shitty hands and get lucky. I also have that feeling during our friendly games and I am just an average player. I can see how it is hard to change your play style between friendly and tournment. For me I enjoy the game probably more then the winning of money. I like the $10 buy ins because it's no big deal if you get "unlucky". If Bundy purpose in coming to the Monday night games is to win the rent money then Cantebary is probably a better place.
Luke have you read Tournament Poker for Advanced Players by David Sklansky? Good explaination of expected values and Tournament strategies. Mostly statistic and math oriented.
Posts: 5484 | From: St. Paul, Mn | Registered: Apr 2002
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quote:Luke have you read Tournament Poker for Advanced Players by David Sklansky?
Yes, this and TJ's book are really the only two ive read aside from the beginner's book i read 4 years ago before starting out. As far as tournement strategy, this is one of the best books you can read by far. He goes into alot of detail, and really gives you the strategy in more of a procedure/point-by-point method than just random thoughts.
But, you do need to be a pretty advanced and experienced player to be able to understand it all. Otherwise what he is talking about isnt really applicable. The only other book i really wnat to read that i havent yet is Mike Caro's "Book of Tells." But, im pretty sure i can name half of what is in that book just from experience in picking up on common tells. Even so, it would still be worth a good read.
-------------------- It doesn't get any more serious than a Rhinocerus about to charge your ass. Posts: 1053 | From: Apple Valley, MN | Registered: Sep 2001
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I would loan you the Tells book except - Michelle's cats tipped over a glass on Mtn. Dew on it. You can still read it but it's kind of puffy. Great book tho - fun to read and then watch Celebrity Poker and spot all the tells. I even noticed a couple on last weeks WSOP event (21 yr old put his hand over his mouth after raising)
I would also recommend Super System - because it's a classic and worth reading. Super System2 comes out in a few weeks - should be a good read.
Posts: 5484 | From: St. Paul, Mn | Registered: Apr 2002
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From what I was told Matt is "taking a break" from Poker, and I think that includes Canterbury as well as Monday nights. He has been having some tough times playing and apparently he has been having to control his "anger" (although I can't imagine Bunday getting "angry") and feels he needs a break. Even in the books they tell you to take a break from it if you get in a tough time every once in while. He will be back soon enough!
I also don't think Matt plays Monday nights to "win the rent money", he plays because he enjoys playing and Mondays give him a great opportunity to analyze why people play the way they do. I actually think Luke is kinda like that too! Always wanting to learn more and get better at it.
-------------------- Clinton '08!!!! Posts: 211 | From: Shakopee, MN | Registered: Aug 2004
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quote:I also don't think Matt plays Monday nights to "win the rent money", he plays because he enjoys playing and Mondays give him a great opportunity to analyze why people play the way they do. I actually think Luke is kinda like that too! Always wanting to learn more and get better at it.
Yeah, thats pretty much the reason i like playing on mondays. Getting some no-limit tournement experience in a friendly and relatively inexpensive enviornement is good for preparing to play at major tournements that Canterbury holds. Sure, its nice to win and get some money once in a while, but i try not to get too bent out of shape if i dont.
And i agree with taking a break once in a while. I had to do that at one point, and it helped. Im sure he will be right back into it in a few weeks.
[ 09-07-2004, 15:27: Message edited by: Ender ]
-------------------- It doesn't get any more serious than a Rhinocerus about to charge your ass. Posts: 1053 | From: Apple Valley, MN | Registered: Sep 2001
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quote:Originally posted by flamingoamyjo: ...I also don't think Matt plays Monday nights to "win the rent money"...
I still have yet to figure out how they do it.
I can paraphrase Bundy in that he thinks he is the best player on Monday nights. He said he gets angry when he gets robbed on the river. But the game is poker, and luck has more to do with it then skill. You can't change the odds of your hand. The skill comes in knowing when to do what and what to do when.
I have to change my sig to say: Fuck Kerry-Edwards and the homo erotic raindow fuck fest that is the Democratic party.
Posts: 740 | From: Tranyland Pending | Registered: Oct 2000
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In truth, there are about 5 guys at the Monday game that think they are "the best" Posts: 5484 | From: St. Paul, Mn | Registered: Apr 2002
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I'm not saying, I am just making an astute observation of what I see.
Posts: 740 | From: Tranyland Pending | Registered: Oct 2000
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I think Scott is right (I can't believe I'm saying this), but I think there are about 5 people who feel they are the best and are far superior then the rest of the monday night players. Just a note, everyone cannot be the best
Also Ender, does is not seem odd to you that you are taking a week off from a real job that is guaranteed to pay to money if you show up, to play a poker tournament in which you have to pay to be there and may win nothing?
Posts: 109 | Registered: Apr 2004
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Luke is actually not worried about losing money. He is confident in his ability to make money overall playing there and is hoping to actually do better than he has in the past.
-------------------- Gisel, I was looking at the picture page and I do have to admit, you look pretty good for a gaming female. Having said that, don't expect any sympathy when we meet on the battlefield. I am a fighter first, lover second. Posts: 2220 | From: Prescott, WI, USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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quote:Also Ender, does is not seem odd to you that you are taking a week off from a real job that is guaranteed to pay to money if you show up, to play a poker tournament in which you have to pay to be there and may win nothing?
Yes, i could work my $12 per hour temporary job instead for my 40 hours that week and make $370 or so after taxes. But, if i get to the final table in just one of those tournements, i will make probibly 10x that in one week. If this was my real salary job like what i will be working in a few months, then i wouldnt really have the oppertinuty to be able to just say "fuck it" and go play.
Sure, i may have shitty luck in all the tournements and not make a dime. But, if i do make something its worth the risk. And like Mike said, im pretty confident that i will at least place in one of those tournements. Honestly though, im looking to win at least one of them.
[ 09-08-2004, 14:56: Message edited by: Ender ]
-------------------- It doesn't get any more serious than a Rhinocerus about to charge your ass. Posts: 1053 | From: Apple Valley, MN | Registered: Sep 2001
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Good luck Luke. I hope you do well. It just seems funny to me to take time off work to play poker. I think that is most people's dream.
You are correct, for you right now, it is more worth it to try to play poker. Look at it this way, all you need to win to make the week worth while is what you would have made at your job. Either way... good luck Posts: 109 | Registered: Apr 2004
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Alright, i guess its my turn to chime in. It makes perfect sense for Luke to take off of work to try to win some money. Like Luke said, make one final table and he made more money in one day than he would make all month. Again, most people think that cards is mostly luck. Play long enough and you will realize that in "Hold-em" luck is 10% and skill 90%. You have to pick your situations right and know who you can manipulate and who you can't based on what is going on in the game. In NO LIMIT you don't even need good cards to be able to do it. The cards basically mean very little.
If luck was such a huge part of the game Luke at Canterbury and me on Pokerstars would not make the final table over a third of the time we enter a tournament. It is your own patience you take advantage of to pick your area to attack, and hope the OTHER PLAYER doesn't get LUCKY.
Now, I don't think I'm one of the "best" players at monday night. What people don't understand about MONDAY is that it is not a "friendly home game". I basically do what Luke does. I try new strategies to see how they work without having to risk a lot of money, so I can make a lot more money when I enter a tournament that matters.
-------------------- "Rarely has it been so clear how much we, the ordinary people of this country, are better than our rulers. I hope that lesson is not lost on anyone, of any political persuasion." Posts: 520 | From: Shakopee, MN USA | Registered: May 2002
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I don't think that those "5 players" feel they are the best players there (although I would be interested in knowing who you think they are) BUT they DO think they are good players and I would have to agree that most of the regular Monday night players are ALL good players (aside from the Jimmy's that show up once in a while).
Good luck Luke, I am sure you will do fine taking the week off, it will pay for itself over and over!
I know it is difficult to believe, but some people actually ARE good enough to be "professional" poker players!
-------------------- Clinton '08!!!! Posts: 211 | From: Shakopee, MN | Registered: Aug 2004
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I think that in order to become a good poker player, you need to play a TON of poker. The situations you see and participate in by just playing are 100% better than what you read or what you hear from others. Obviously there are some great resources available for poker now online and in books that may increase your odds, or allow you to spot a tell but it really comes down to playing, playing, playing. I wish I had more time to come play on Mondays. I actually played last Sunday with some married couples at a friends house in Hudson on Sunday. I want you to know that it could be way way worse than what you see on your Monday nights. One girl won 7 hands in a row with nothing worse than a set of queens. She seriously hit
set of queens flush flush straight full boat straight set of kings
in a row... Every hand was a draw for her... Needless to say, I got knocked out of that game with a top set (jacks) when she hit one of her straights runner runner... After watching the rest of that game, I had no problem winning the second game based on their poor judgements.
-------------------- Gisel, I was looking at the picture page and I do have to admit, you look pretty good for a gaming female. Having said that, don't expect any sympathy when we meet on the battlefield. I am a fighter first, lover second. Posts: 2220 | From: Prescott, WI, USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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Luke - I just heard a rumor on the poker forum that Hinkley is opening a poker room end of this month.
Posts: 5484 | From: St. Paul, Mn | Registered: Apr 2002
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Anyone around Saturday night for some cards? Luke said he would be up for it also...
-------------------- Gisel, I was looking at the picture page and I do have to admit, you look pretty good for a gaming female. Having said that, don't expect any sympathy when we meet on the battlefield. I am a fighter first, lover second. Posts: 2220 | From: Prescott, WI, USA | Registered: Apr 2001
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if you guys don't get enough together for a full table or what ever I will be hosting a few games on saturday as always. friendly games with 5-10 buy ins unless we all feel rich and get a hair up our asses. we mostly start at 7-8ish so let me know how many if you decide you wanna come out. I believe we have about 6 for sure players this week for the early game and more after 10ish.
Posts: 208 | From: Chaska MN | Registered: Aug 2002
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Great book tho - fun to read and then watch Celebrity Poker and spot all the tells. I even noticed a couple on last weeks WSOP event (21 yr old put his hand over his mouth after raising)
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